ORAS 2U Discussion Thread

ORAS 2U has been formed! This is the banlist:

All Rules and Bans from ORAS 1U + Banned Pokémon: Arceus, Arceus-Dark, Arceus-Electric, Arceus-Fairy, Arceus-Ghost, Arceus-Grass, Arceus-Ground, Arceus-Rock, Arceus-Water, Blaziken [Mega], Darkrai, Deoxys-Attack, Deoxys-Speed, Dialga, Diancie [Mega], Ferrothorn, Genesect, Giratina-O, Gliscor, Groudon, Ho-oh, Kangaskhan [Mega], Klefki, Kyogre, Landorus-T, Latias, Latios, Lucario [Mega], Lugia, Mewtwo, Palkia, Rayquaza, Sableye [Mega], Shaymin-S, Tyranitar, Xerneas, Yveltal, Zekrom

What looks to be the most threatening Pokémon? Let's talk about the tier here!

Here's a bunch of scary looking things that are legal (but not in Smogon's ORAS OU!):

 

I guess my first thought is holy we have some powerful stuff in this meta, Kyurem-White with good speed, perfect coverage, great STABs, and 170 SpA, obviously all of the arceus formes around, giratina looks like the only amazing wall we got but that's weak to most of the scariest attackers, there's also reshiram... Kyurem-White though is the only one that straight away feels as if it's probably broken. Got to do some testing!

 

Some analysis
probably the worst arc form? Still it's a deoxys check / has nice super effective coverage vs psychics which no other arc form has. Needs defog support like everything else...
gonna be really interesting. Doesn't wall much of the most uber-powerful stuff but it + chansey handles most of the meta I think. Also gets cool shit like wisp and defog
I like the idea of a cm / judgement / dragon pulse / recover set. Main issues are anything that also wall reshiram, so like azumarill, toxic chansey, and also heatran [which doesn't wall resh because of turboblaze].
super powerfluffy. Appreciates defog support but it has great power and coverage. Roost is also sick.
I could see this being nice actually; it's got the right typing for really reliable defog, I could see this + roost kyurem white or something as a really solid stallbreaking core.
Suicide rocks and stuff would be awesome on this. Not actually 100% sure yet it needs sash, it actually survives weak hits surprisingly well
basically the fastest offensive dragon out of this lot (though other things like mega sceptile exist). Not sure how much it would be used though
insane power. Azumarill is the best check I've seen so far; tailwind is cool, but it is rocks weak. I guess m-alt and regular diancie act as possible checks too, and faster arceus formes like arc-fire. Scarf and LO look deadly.
THE best defensive answer to deo-n in the game.
great typing and stats, I'm sure this'll work nicely.
will be a nice spiker etc for offense.
monoCM / CM + Earth Power is sick. Main issue is lack of defensive utility + Rocks weakness
cool. great coverage, also spikes/tspikes are cool
should be a good arc forme but not got much niche over kyu-w other than no dragon/fairy weakness, faster, and access to CM.
stronk but slow. Will see how this works out but it does have a great typing [could be a decent kyu-w check]
looks ok but doesn't resist much of use in this meta as far as I can gather. Offensively tho judgement / shadow ball / cm / recover looks nice and it doesn't have a rocks weakness
this is cool. speed boost + baton pass to maw sounds sick [I actually use that in 1U too!!!!] probably not one of the more devastating things offensively tho
nice defensive typing, should be a good glue, as a really fast and fairly bulky steel type. Also, a defogger

 

Finally... Time for some expert analysis.

- Imo, this is going to be best Pokemon in the tier. It is literally insane the amount of things Giratina can accomplish. Need a physical wall? Not a problem. Choice Band user? Yes sir. Set up sweeper? Physical and special. Stallbreaker? In every way. I think this is going to be a staple on a lot of teams, especially with its great coverage.

- These mons are crazy powerful lol. Chansey, according to a calc I did, can be 3HKOd which is absolutely insane. Hopefully something gets discovered that lets these become a bit more defeatable.

Deoxys needs to seem fun as well, can't wait to test. Will post more later.

 

This is a really nice check to both Kyurem-White and Reshiram. Resh's only way of hitting it really are Wisp / Power Herb + Solarbeam / Sun + Solarbeam / HP Grass / Earth Power [most strong neutral attack]. Kyurem-White only has Earth Power / HP Grass, but it does have a higher attacking stat [170 vs 150]. Curious to see how we'd adapt Kyu-W and Resh...

 

Just thinking about what else might be viable

Spoiler

What here stands out? I think being faster than arceus forms (so over 120) might be pretty important, which benefits stuff like gren, torn-t, mega zam, mega manec, m-lop, and weavile... as well as speed boosters, priority users, etc. ...

also the list above with arc forms out in front

Spoiler

Also note the arc forms are: Bug / Dragon / Fighting / Fire / Flying / Ice / Poison / Psychic / Steel

 

I kinda feel like this is probably broken even from really initial testing, but I want to play a bit first. Wisp / Dual STAB / Roost or tailwind or flame charge, this set beats all counters not named chansey, or at the very least cripples them hard on switch-in. Whilst it's rocks weak and offensive teams can focus on outspeeding it to some degree, it's still pretty fast, insanely powerful, has perfect coverage on its stabs barring azumarill which doesn't like taking a wisp (or that 20% blue flare burn chance..) supporting it isn't too challenging with a bunch of usable defog arceuses [arc poison and steel stand out in particular as good choices for defog]. I feel like this will probably be the first suspect.


I thought up an interesting core for this with some help from enigami. SD with stab + edgequake seems nice, magnezone as a partner to trap skarm/scizor, and hoopa-u to beat giratina teams.

 

Alright from the testing I've done so far, this is what I expect viability to look like:

S Rank:

Reshiram - This thing is just about broken lol. It virtually has 0 counters, until of course you discover its actual set.. and by then it's too late. A sub set is intimidating as fuck especially when you take in consideration all of the moves it has access to. Substitute can use two different items pretty much, those being Leftovers and Life Orb / Flame Plate / STAB booster. A Life Orb set with sub / roost / stabs takes out a good chunk of the tier, as long as hazards are out of the way. Lefties would be used on a bulkier set such as sub / roost / toxic or wow / filler as a way to lure in special walls like Chansey. I haven't even touched on the likes of Flame Charge sets, or Choice sets. It can lure in special walls with Scarf / Band Outrages, or neutralize them with Specs Dracos. One more fun thing I see it being able to run is a support Tailwind set, which isn't even bad considering it's kind of like Flame Charge.

Yeah I don't see anything else being S rank right now, that is if you take the S rank description to heart. This rank should be reserved for the mons that dominate the tier. Does Reshiram provide multiple roles for a team or do one extremely well? Yes, in fact, it does all of its roles with quite a bit of success. Is the risk vs. reward more reward? Definitely, actually the only real downside I see to using this thing is if you truly want to build around a core and you see types stacking, or if you don't want hazard support for some reason.

A+ Rank:

(Some Arceus form(s) probably belong here but I haven't been able to test every single Pokemon in the tier yet)

Deoxys - Oh my goodness this thing is scary. I don't want to go into too much detail on its sets, mostly cause it only has 2, maybe 3 at most. First you have a solid wallbreaker set that can run LO or Mind Plate. Coverage basically comes down to what your team needs broken, but most likely you are going to have Psycho Boost on this set. Coverage moves include: Psycho Boost, Fire Punch, Hidden Power Fire, Knock Off, Zen Headbutt, Focus Blast, Shadow Ball, Extreme Speed, and many others. Next you have a lead type set with Stealth Rock, filler, filler, filler. Most likely you are running Focus Sash, and the 3 other moves come down to what you want accomplished by your lead. You could get Spikes up, Taunt to prevent rocks, Knock Off to cripple a threat, Screens, Psycho for damage, etc. Not to mention that Deoxys is the fastest Pokemon in the tier, even topping some scarfers. The final set is a Nasty Plot set, which is most likely going to be a nuke set if you want full power. This set could run a plethora of items including: LO, Expert Belt, Plates, etc. Coverage, again, comes down to what you need. The biggest thing I see is something like Nasty Plot / STAB / Focus Blast or Hidden Power Fire / Shadow Ball. No matter what set you use, you are getting a fast threat that hits hard, and with the lacking of checks and switch ins, this is worthy of A+.

Giratina - So I'll admit, I was way wrong when talking about Giratina before ORAS 2U was formed. I thought this would be the absolute best Pokemon, and ridiculously overpowered for the meta. After testing it though, I wouldn't say that it wasn't good because that would be a blatant lie, but it was extremely underwhelming compared to what I thought it was going to be. However, this is not to keep it from being A+ rank due to its sheer unpredictability, natural bulk and stellar typing, and its vast movepool. Giratina is like Reshiram in a lot of ways, basically being the exact same skeletal mons, just Reshiram is offensive, and Giratina is defensive, and each can run the other's set for decent success. I'd say the main reason why Giratina shouldn't be S is because of its lack of reliable recovery.

Kyurem White - Yet another extremely powerful dragon type Pokemon. Kyurem-White is probably the strongest Pokemon in the tier, being able to 3HKO (if I remember correctly) Chansey lol. It's basically a stronger Reshiram, with a different STAB and a wider movepool. The reason it's a rank below Reshiram basically comes down to Ice being such a hindering typing, and its inability to run a more defensive set. Other than those flaws however, Kyurem-White is definitely the strongest and one of the most threatening Pokemon in the tier, which is why I belive it deserves A+ rank.

That's what I personally see as top 4 mons in the tier after all of my testing. A rank will probably be giant, considering all of the great mons in this tier. I see a couple Arc forms, Azumarill, either Aegislash / Mega Metagross / Mega Scizor, and many other Pokemon. I really like the tier so far and I hope to see others get into it.

 

So is just no one interested in the meta? That's quite sad.

 

Not much it seems well if / when we pick up in interest in ORAS it should get a look at I feel